Forum ban appeal (email) - DragonSlayer2189

Me and zeseryu share similar views on this. I would suggest reading his posts to understand where I’m coming from. Object for Zeseryu's reasons.

I agree, that Dragon should be punished for what he did, but I think a permanent ban is excessive. I believe his offense warrants a temporary ban, not a permanent one. There are two issues with this scenario that I have. One, context is not being taken into account. Bannable offenses are "Bans that restrict the user from accessing the forums as a registered user depending on the severity of the offense." It was not really a severe offense, just a stupid joke. Did it really hurt anyone? No. Was it stupid and immature? Yes. Should he go unpunished for it? No, but why do we need to keep someone permanently banned for a stupid joke? I am not saying what he did is okay, but to immediately permanently ban someone who is quite active in our community for a stupid joke seems unfair to me.

The other issue is something I have been preaching about for a while now and is addressed in this thread, but it seems to be getting no attention when this is actually a major issue in our community. People requesting forum sanctions should not be in charge of deciding what happens to the person, that is why we have forum moderators and administrators. They should be the ones deciding the punishment.

Just my opinion.

Object

It has only been about a week since your punishment.

vouch but give it another week

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@zeseryu#2936 The rules are pretty clear. They also have not changed.

I never said that the rules changed. I said that the enforcement of the rule itself did.

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@zeseryu#2936 There is no "leniency" when the infraction and punishment is clearly listed.

Yes, the punishment and infraction are listed in the policy, but that doesn't mean anything if the people who are supposed to enforce it and hold others accountable aren't doing so. We have several cases of the past that prove this was the case.

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@zeseryu#2936 The "leniency" you experienced came from you not getting caught. Dragon got caught, was indefinitely suspended, a forum sanction request was filled and accepted.

It was absolutely not a matter of me "not getting caught". It was a matter of leniency, I posted my alt's name changes on the forums each time I did it. Hell, I was even planning on publicly outing myself a while later, a move which you yourself discouraged me from doing at the time.

Name Change Threads:

1. First occurrence: https://totalfreedom.boards.net/thread/64492/video-xxwilee999xx
2. Second occurrence: https://totalfreedom.boards.net/thread/65413/b…in-xxwilee999xx
3. Third occurrence: https://totalfreedom.boards.net/thread/65656/x…olarisseltzeris

Not only that, but people had every reason to know that the user operating the alternate account was me. The NameMC profile for my alternate account contained all of the information identifying the account as me.

So no, it wasn't a matter of me hiding anything and not getting caught. People knew about it, but simply didn't act upon it, which would fit the definition of leniency.

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@zeseryu#2936 If you want to loosen up on the punishment, this isnt the thread to suggest that on.

I know. The reason I noted two things that should have been done in my original reply to this thread was to note how the situation could have been handled better instead of outright banning him.

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@zeseryu#2936 You want to know what really is a bad precedent? Allowing an offense to be committed consistently. That's it. Stop allowing it. Ban the people who do it. Dragon should be banned. Its that simple. There shouldn't have to be a warning to stop breaking the rules when the rules are already clear.

I'm not saying we should allow offenses to be committed consistently. In fact, it's the opposite. We should absolutely not allow these kinds of offenses, but in this case going from entirely lenient to full-blown punishments is too harsh (especially considering the circumstances that I've touched up on in my previous posts). I'm not saying we should consistently be lenient on cases like this either, the reason I'm saying the severity of his punishment is uncalled for is because we were lenient and suddenly without warning we're not. Any future incidents should result in an indefinite ban like normally, but I believe this case is a special case and should be treated as such.

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@videogamesm12#2967 It was absolutely not a matter of me "not getting caught". It was a matter of leniency, I posted my alt's name changes on the forums each time I did it. Hell, I was even planning on publicly outing myself a while later, a move which you yourself discouraged me from doing at the time.

Yes, exactly. You didn't pretend to be these users. You used their name. Dragon directly impersonated them and tried to convince us it really was Nathaniel. You didn't post a message in an admin-lounge saying 'Woah its x they must be legit'. He did.

Vouch. Like other people said a perm ban is excessive for this.

For anyone here (As there are a few) questioning it being permanent, could I suggest reviewing the forum posting guidelines as this was a category 1 offence for the forums, and the same happened in game... https://forum.totalfreedom.me/d/5-forum-posting-guidelines

@wild1145#3054

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@Xen#2938 One, context is not being taken into account. Bannable offenses are "Bans that restrict the user from accessing the forums as a registered user depending on the severity of the offense." It was not really a severe offense, just a stupid joke. Did it really hurt anyone? No. Was it stupid and immature? Yes. Should he go unpunished for it? No, but why do we need to keep someone permanently banned for a stupid joke? I am not saying what he did is okay, but to immediately permanently ban someone who is quite active in our community for a stupid joke seems unfair to me.

Not to mention the stuff Video has brought up regarding people in the past changing their IGNs and not getting punished for it. People on the Discord like to change their nicknames to the same as others all the time (a ton of people literally changed their name to Ryan one day and you did nothing about it).

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@Xen#3057 It was not really a severe offense, just a stupid joke. Did it really hurt anyone? No. Was it stupid and immature? Yes. Should he go unpunished for it? No, but why do we need to keep someone permanently banned for a stupid joke? I am not saying what he did is okay, but to immediately permanently ban someone who is quite active in our community for a stupid joke seems unfair to me.

It's a rule they've then decided to breach multiple times, so they clearly haven't learnt from their mistakes... What you call a stupid joke others see as attacking or mocking an individual not to mention the fact that in this case Dragon was an admin and should have known the rules fully well... It's not the first time they've broken the rules, and the fact they decided to commit the same offence and bypass at the same time during this ban makes me struggle to see why anyone should be forgiving and vouch on his return? This isn't the type of behaviour I'd expect from a random player, much less an experienced administrator...

@wild1145#3058 I am not vouching for their return, I believe we should change the permanent ban into a temporary one.

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Vouch, I never thought a permanent ban was necessary.
Switching to an object. I believe he should remain banned, but it should only be temporary. See my post here.

@Xen#3059 This is his appeal thread... You're vouching for him to either remain banned or to be un-banned... If neither of those is what you're after I think a separate thread is more appropriate?

@wild1145#3060

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I believe he should remain banned

I literally said that. An appeal thread is not strictly limited to whether the user should be unbanned or not. It is a discussion about the user appealing. It is unnecessary to make a whole new thread just to ask if their punishment can be changed.

@Xen#3061 Apologies I mis-read what your quote meant on the last message. Thought you were vouching but then saying actually no they should be banned still which was what I was getting at.

Object Permaban I agree is too harsh but as said many times they clearly havent learnt their lesson. Needs a little more time its too soon since most recent violation.

Vouch, obviously you messed up, but you were punished way too hard.

object, permban is too long of a duration but a week is too short - i don't think i can count on my fingers how many incidents you have done relating to this
ill vouch if he reappeals in a few weeks

I Object. Bypassing bans doesn't help your case either.